From the Forum: Trade Carlos Beltran for Manny Ramirez and Jacoby Ellsbury

User "metsfan08" threw out a crazy idea on Mets Lounge this morning, something I want to hear other people's opinions on. Here it is, in it's entirety:

Last night I was listening to the WFAN and a caller had an interesting proposal for a trade for Manny Ramirez.

IF the BoSox were willing to trade both Jacoby Ellsbury AND Manny Ramirez in exchange for Carlos Beltran, should Omar Minaya make the trade?
Let's examine this hypothetical trade--
-The Mets would gain 2 outfielders for this season.
-Manny would be a rental because he might not be willing to sign with the Mets after this season. -Manny in the clean-up spot with Delgado hitting 5th.. WOW!
-Ellsbury is 25 y.o. and CHEAP!! Think of all the money we would save next year.. money we could use to pursue a 1st and/or 2nd baseman..

-The BoSox would not have to deal with Manny.
-They still have Coco Crisp so they would still have 3 outfielders.
-Beltran is 31 y.o. and is under contract until 2012.
-BoSox could still be in contention with Beltran in the line-up instead of Manny.

On paper, this trade looks like a win-win situation with the Mets getting the slightly longer end of the stick. As much as I LOVE Beltran, I must admit that Omar Minaya would have to be crazy to not jump on this trade. What do you guys think? Someone give me a reason to KEEP Beltran.. PLEASE!!

And here is user "nymrods" response:

I say yes because I'm a big Ellsbury fan, so I might be slightly partial, but...

Well, Manny makes up for the lack of power Ellsbury has (or doesn't) and Beltran did. Ellsbury is a good (Church-like) fielder, and young, so he'll improve. Now, Beltran is a wizard in the field, so we would be losing a little in the fielding, but I think Ellsbury's age is very promising. He will improve all around (this is only his first real season anyways). And besides, we'd have Manny. Older, but still amazing!!

Beltran (Avg #s): .279 BA; 26 HR; 108 RBI; .355 OBP (13th year)
Ellsbury (Avg #s): .286 BA; 5 HR; 32 RBI; .346 OBP (First starting season)
Ramirez (Avg #s): .312 BA; 30 HR; 98 RBI; .409 OBP (17th year)

Tough call. Honestly though, do we do it? I like the idea, but I don't think that it solves any problem.

And finally, my answer:

OK...let's see... Ellsbury is OK. Endy Chavez-esque in my opinion.
Manny has a team option for the next two years, at $20mil a pop.
We have enough money coming off the books next year...Alou for sure, Pedro almost for sure, Delgado maybe, Perez (hopefully re-sign)...
The Sox do not like Crisp, at all.

Reason?...You need reasons to keep him [Beltran]? OK, LOOK...Beltran was never an average hitter. Never has been, never will be. He hit .307 and .306 once...every other year he hovers around .275ish. He's driven in 100+ each year except that one miserable 2005.

He OPS .800-.900+ consistently. His OBP is usually .350+ Oh yeah, and he's one of, if not the best fielder in the NL...and tops in MLB. He makes everything look easy. DID YOU SEE YESTERDAY'S GAME!

Thoughts? Responses? Let's hear it on Mets Lounge or in the comments!

Mike Pelfrey to receive innings cap

According to Adam Rubin, the Mets will try to limit the number of pitches and innings that Mike Pelfrey throws this season, trying to prevent the young pitcher from hitting a wall.

From Rubin:

Mike Pelfrey's pitch counts may soon be reduced. The organization would prefer Pelfrey not exceed 180 innings in his first full major-league season. Pelfrey currently is at 122-2/3 innings with roughly 11 starts remaining.

Usually, I'd hate this, but we're seeing a clear sign of it in Duaner Sanchez right now. He seems to have hit a wall only half way into the season, but remember he hasn't pitched in one and a half years.

Something like this needs to be monitored but not fully and strictly enforced. If there are chances to give him a break, give them, but don't pull him out of great starts just because he's nearing his innings cap.

Early Morning Madness: Johan Santana is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't

This is sickening.

When Johan Santana didn't come out for the ninth inning against the Phillies, and the Mets eventually lost, everyone was screaming about "Why didn't Johan demand to come back into the game?!?"

This time around, when it was 9-1, Johan stayed in the game...and he's still getting blasted in the media.

From Filip Bondy, someone I usually enjoy reading, entitled "Johan Santana going nine in rout doesn't make complete sense":

And so the most important and expensive pitcher on the Mets' staff went out and threw some unnecessary fastballs Sunday in the ninth. If you're a message kind of guy, you were applauding his gutsy show. If you're more of a pitch-count realist, you were horrified at the illogic of it all. Manuel only intended to allow Santana to reach 115 pitches, but then there were two outs and the complete game was too close to sabotage.

Well, he only went up to 118, not far off from the 115 tipping point. He started the 8th inning with only 81 pitches. 81! But more importantly, he saved the bullpen that used every pitcher while throwing nine inning of relief nearly 12 hours earlier.

What does Santana have to do in this town to prove himself? Go out, throw a no hitter through seven innings (limiting himself to only three pitches per batter, mind you), hand the ball over to the bullpen and call it a day?

This is getting sad. Johan Santana is damned if he doesn't beg and plead with Jerry Manuel to go out for the ninth inning one day, but when he does, even with an 8 run lead, and the chance to give the bullpen a well needed day off, he's damned again.

Lay off this guy, please. Sure, he has the biggest contract of any pitcher to date, but his last two starts have been simply spectacular. His ERA is 2.93, good for 6th in the league, he's #3 in the league for innings pitched, and he's top 10 or close in nearly every other pitching category.

He's the ace of this staff. He's a stud pitcher, and there is no denying that. Let him go out, earn his money, and help this team as much as possible. He can do it, he's a veteran, one of the best in the league.

Give me a break.

TSTDIA: Mets 9 -- Cardinals 1

Johan Santana turned in his second stellar start in a row, not needing to hand the ball over in the ninth and ending up going the distance, allowing six hits one only one run. Santana was backed up by a 17 hit effort from the Mets, aided by home runs from David Wright, Fernando Tatis, and Ramon Castro. Johan helped his own cause, going 2-4 with an RBI and run scored.

Beautiful game all around. No faults at all.

The Dark Knight heads to China

Adam Rubin is reporting the Mets have designated Brandon Knight for assignment and will head to Beijing to join Davey Johnson and Team USA. Willie Collazo has been activated to take over the empty roster spot.

So long, Brandon. Not a bad four innings after you shook off the nerves.

Maybe the new IBAF rule could have helped the Mets last night

The IBAF, the International Baseball Federation (doesn't IBF make more sense?), has started motions to change the rules of baseball for the Olympics.

Under their new system, if the game goes into the 11th inning, the team at bat will have the option of starting their lineup in any position, and having the two players ahead of that position in the lineup start on second and first base. For example, if these rules were intact, the Mets could have started the bottom of the 11th inning with Endy Chavez on second and Carlos Beltran on first, with Carlos Delgado at bat. They could have done the exact same thing in the 12th inning, and beyond. Now if MLB had that rule, I'm not sure if would have helped the Mets because they were a putrid 1-16 with runners in scoring position, but we will never know.

Anyway, I have a question that wasn't answered in the article: If those runners score, who are they charged to? Does it go to the pitcher that started the inning, even though he really didn't let them on? He would be getting screwed if he lets up one hit, and a run scores just because he was the unlucky bum to get tabbed for the 11th inning.

It's kind of like college football's overtime system, where you pretty much dare the other team to score by starting them on the opposing team's 25-yard line. One hit could easily score one, or two runs, as opposed to having to string together a few in a row, something the Mets simply could not do last night.

This new rules works in international baseball, but it would ruin marathon games in MLB. It might save pitchers, not forcing a guy to throw nearly 60 pitches in relief when his previous high was in the 30's (Aaron Heilman), but it would also destroy the marathon game. Games were it's the 17th or 18th inning and each team simply refuses to give up. Managers have to pull out every trick in the book to make the team work, and both teams go punch for punch, taking the game long into the night.

I love games like that, just like I loved last night's Mets game. Jerry Manuel and Tony La Russa were each managing their team full tilt, and the players were doing everything they could to try and score runs. Unfortunately, La Russa's team came through in the end, but due to the Mets tenacity and fight, I, like most Mets fans today, don't have that bitter taste of defeat in our mouths. The team battled long and hard, they just came out on the short end of the stick.

I support instant replay in MLB, but please, don't bring on this rule anywhere near America's pastime.

TSTDIA: Cardinals 10 -- Mets 8

A valiant effort. The Mets battled back twice, but couldn't get ahead for good. Simply a great game. Very entertaining, I must say.

The Mets went 1-16 with RISP. It absolutely killed them. Still a fun game to watch with four home runs.

Another fan falls at Shea Stadium

Going to Shea Stadium may be hazardous to your health.

For the second time this season and the third time at Mets games this season, another fan has fallen and is seriously injured. A fan was also injured when the Mets were at Turner Field earlier this year, and one fan was killed at Shea Stadium previously this season.

From the AP:

Firefighters say a person has been seriously hurt in a fall at Shea Stadium during a New York Mets game.

The Fire Department says the victim has been taken to a hospital unconscious after falling around 10 p.m. tonight, as the Mets played the St. Louis Cardinals. Firefighters had no immediate details on the victim or where in the stadium he or she fell.

Take. The. Stairs.

Trade for Manny Ramirez at all costs

Update: Everything I mention seems to get blown out of the water within 24 hours. Jon Heyman reports the Mets won't look into Manny at all. I think my next article will deal with how the Mets won't win the World Series this year.

With Manny Ramirez's latest antics, Red Sox Nation seems to be reaching the end of it's rope with their left fielder.Trade for this guy at all costs. I'd be willing to part with Jon Niese, Eddie Kunz or some package of a few top prospects for this high caliber player. He's a professional hitter, and would take over left field for the Mets, something they dearly need for the stretch.

Jerry Manuel seems like the kind of guy who would be able to keep Ramirez in line, and Omar Minaya has always had a love for Manny.

Could you imagine Manny in a Mets uniform? Oh man. Let's just imagine this lineup, as I see it:
Jose Reyes
Ryan Church / Endy Chavez
Carlos Beltran
Carlos Delgado
David Wright
Manny Ramirez
Brian Schneider / Ramon Castro
Damion Easley / Argenis Reyes
Pitchers spot

Holy hell. That's powerful. If this is possible, at all, pull the trigger. People would be lining up around the block for Mets tickets just to watch his antics and ability. I know I would.

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